tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329600504016968888.post6232407513042325738..comments2024-03-27T15:47:46.091-05:00Comments on Pastoral Meanderings: A Chaste Life and Contraception. . .Pastor Petershttp://www.blogger.com/profile/10653554256101480140noreply@blogger.comBlogger11125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329600504016968888.post-33597567675702149272014-07-02T19:43:15.985-05:002014-07-02T19:43:15.985-05:00Can a Christian husband and wife use birth-control...Can a Christian husband and wife use birth-control for family planning? Are there ever financial, medical, psychological, or other reasons that would make a temporary use of birth-control permissible within marriage?<br /><br />It seems to me that "be fruitful and multiply" might be blessing language and gift language. Eat of any of the trees of the garden. Be fruitful and multiply. Yes, if one were to refuse entirely to eat, that would be a perversion of the gift God gave. Yes, if husband and wife refuse entirely to be fruitful and multiply, that would be a perversion of the gift God has given. <br /><br />But I am having a hard time reading pre-fall "be fruitful and multiply" in the way of post-fall Law. How many children must I have? How many daily attempts to multiply must I make? <br /><br />I am told that contraception is strictly forbidden by this Law, be fruitful and multiply, because it means we are no open to the gift of life. So what if my wife and I know that her cycle is such that fertilization is, humanly-speaking, impossible - "must" we or "must" we not? And, again, how much fruit and how much multiplication must we do to fulfill this Law?<br /><br />Is this really what God had in mind? Or can husband and wife be fruitful and multiply, and yet abstain from time-to-time? Can husband and wife be fruitful and multiply, and yet use "rhythm method" or birth control from time to time? <br /><br />Are anti-contraception pastors certain they aren't burdening consciences with loads God never meant them to bear?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329600504016968888.post-80232485438865926252014-06-29T09:53:26.809-05:002014-06-29T09:53:26.809-05:00"They are connected. It is unfair to talk inc..."They are connected. It is unfair to talk incessantly against gay sex while tolerating straight cohabitation."<br /><br /><br />No one in the LCMS is talking incessantly against gay marriage. I go to church at least once a weak, including bible studies and other groups. No one ever talks about it at all. <br /><br />I have head preaching against divorce and extramarital sex, but never against gays ever. <br /><br />So, pastors are doing a good job.<br /><br />And the media is totally lying when it says pastors are preaching incessantly against gays. It is not happening and it has not happened. The media lies. Stop declaring their lies to be truth.<br /><br />Pastor Peters,<br /><br />please ask the pastors that you know personally how many times they have preached against gays and how many times they have preached against divorce and extramarital sex. You will find what I am saying is true.<br /><br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329600504016968888.post-56986652803735294162014-06-28T21:38:58.201-05:002014-06-28T21:38:58.201-05:00Opposition to contraception is a catholic position...Opposition to contraception is a catholic position and prior to the 1930s was held by every substantial grouping among Christians including Baptists, Lutherans, Reformed, Roman Catholics and Eastern Orthodox. The slide to depravity started in the 1930s with, as is pretty much always the case with such errors, the Anglicans.David Grayhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11966977894876326659noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329600504016968888.post-9147853190678496642014-06-28T21:26:23.295-05:002014-06-28T21:26:23.295-05:00I am the second anonymous poster. I agree with ev...I am the second anonymous poster. I agree with everything you wrote; I was merely making the observation that divorce and remarriage among Christians is tolerated and seen as OK, when Paul in 1 Cor 7 says otherwise. We should not be condemning others for that which we ourselves are just as guilty of.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329600504016968888.post-70207198262248841552014-06-28T16:44:38.684-05:002014-06-28T16:44:38.684-05:00I suppose I jumped to conclusions and owe you an a...I suppose I jumped to conclusions and owe you an apology. On Lutheran blogs I have come across some support for homosexuality, particularly from ELCA pastors, and from other denominations as well...and have come to the conclusion there are theologians trying to twist scripture in any technical way possible to bring about some justification for accepting gay marriage. I am sure you have seen this happening as well. I apologize for jumping to a conclusion you were not advancing. I do not agree with your last statement that "the vast majority of Christians no longer see sex outside of marriage as wrong or sinful except perhaps for gays." In my view, most devout Christians know and acknowledge that sex between men and women outside of marriage is sinful....but may do it anyway...not in spite or in blatant disobedience but due to the biological urges inherent in human passion, inability to restrain this urge, and most couples in this condition will marry as soon as possible. The sexual drive is no small thing...it is powerful....after hunger, thirst, and survival. I believe all people struggle with sexual temptation, including the most devout and faithful believers. That is why prayer for grace is needed, particularly for young people. That is why marriage between a man and a woman must be encouraged by the church.John Joseph Flanaganhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06596324816480709495noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329600504016968888.post-72158258718660708212014-06-28T15:24:56.685-05:002014-06-28T15:24:56.685-05:00Did you read what I wrote? I am not plugging gay ...Did you read what I wrote? I am not plugging gay marriage but simply saying that we cannot be against gay marriage and silent or tolerant about the contraceptive ideal that underlies the rampant heterosexual cohabitation. They are connected. It is unfair to talk incessantly against gay sex while tolerating straight cohabitation. Underlying this cohabitation debate is how contraception has become the norm for Christian couples also. At some point we Lutherans will have to speak about contraception beyond the normal condemnation of abortion or abortificients. There is nothing here to suggest that I am on the side of normalizing gay marriage and there is no Gospel here for sin that has become normative so I reject the complaint that it is all law. It is all law because the vast majority of Christians no longer see sex outside of marriage wrong or sinful EXCEPT perhaps for gays. That is untenable theologically and morally.<br /><br />To the two anonymous commenters, read what I have written again. To John Flanagan, what did I write that was rubbish? It is provocative to address the sin of cohabitation or sex outside of marriage as an equal if not greater problem than the gay issues but if that is rubbish then the commandments and Scripture is rubbish.<br /><br /> Pastor Petersnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329600504016968888.post-47092788399127661392014-06-28T13:22:17.242-05:002014-06-28T13:22:17.242-05:00Furthermore, although I am a Lutheran from the LCM...Furthermore, although I am a Lutheran from the LCMS for some years, and although I am an old man not far from 70 years of age.....if more LCMS pastors write similar rubbish and actually believe what they are teaching...then it will be time for me to leave the denomination and wipe the very dust of prevalent apostasy from my shoes, and by the grace of God, I shall find somewhere a faithful church to worship in the final days of my life.John Joseph Flanaganhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06596324816480709495noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329600504016968888.post-25264840447221323812014-06-28T11:38:18.241-05:002014-06-28T11:38:18.241-05:00This is just another way to muddy up the waters ab...This is just another way to muddy up the waters about sexual sin. Sex within marriage is the Biblical and Christian guideline. If the author wants to plug gay marriage and use the contraceptive argument for heterosexuals as a theme for hypocrisy, then he is quite misguided, and for a pastor to use this argument as a basis for tolerance of homosexuality is contemptible.John Joseph Flanaganhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06596324816480709495noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329600504016968888.post-42570699508652437332014-06-28T10:28:46.016-05:002014-06-28T10:28:46.016-05:00Yet another blog post of Law without any Gospel. ...Yet another blog post of Law without any Gospel. when will pastors learn that the number one reason we are losing this debate is because we keep addressing issues like this without the Gospel? (both liberal and conservative have completely thrown the Gospel out the window).<br /><br />Pastors, keep it up if you want to see gay marriage become the norm in America.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329600504016968888.post-75960380039134078162014-06-28T08:12:28.632-05:002014-06-28T08:12:28.632-05:00Please address the prevalence of divorce and remar...Please address the prevalence of divorce and remarriage in the church. The scriptures say it is sinful, and yet it is permitted. When marriage is no longer between one man and one woman *for life*, gay and lesbian marriage, as well as other forms of marriage, are the logical next step. Your thoughts?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6329600504016968888.post-49627000672074278222014-06-28T07:17:42.556-05:002014-06-28T07:17:42.556-05:00Oh, this is so good. Oh, this is so good. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com